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27 NOVEMBER 1939
SRI AUROBINDO: I have given that up, as I told you. DR. MANILAL: You used to say you were pleased, there was some peace, harmony, etc. SRI AUROBINDO: Harmony? Peace maybe. DR . MANILAL : Last time you said, "I can do some things more easily now." SRI AUROBINDO: Are you asking me about my own progress? DR. MANILAL: Your progress is our progress. We go along with you; at least with the tail end. (Laughter) SRI AUROBINDO: I wish you did. Then you would be very near the head. The tail of a comet is very long! DR. MANILAL: Then please tell us about individual progress say, about mine. SRI AUROBINDO: All I can say about you is: you seem to be getting on. DR. MANILAL: I told you that myself, Sir. Some people say they felt great Ananda, great satisfaction at the Darshan, while I didn't feel anything. SRI AUROBINDO: There you are! How can I tell about the general progress then? DR'. MANILAL: How is it I didn't feel anything. Sir? SRI AUROBINDO: You may have been too much in the physical. To feel anything, the thickness of your body (laughing) — I mean the materiality of it—must be reduced. NIRODBARAN: Does it mean that those who felt something had some opening or had made some progress? SRI AUROBINDO: An opening at the moment at least, or they may have been in the vital. It is the physical consciousness that comes in the way. DR. MANILAL: Formerly I used to feel something, but now I don't. Does it mean that all I had gained has been lost? SRI AUROBINDO: No, all that remains behind while the work is going on in front. It is a very stupid stage. NIRODBARAN: Does everybody have to go through this stupid stage? SRI AUROBINDO: At least I had to. DR. MANILAL: People also see visions and lights, though I don't necessarily call that a sign of progress. SRI AUROBINDO: You don't see visions? Page-261 DR. MANILAL: No. Sir. SRI AUROBINDO: But you had two, one after the other, and yet you say you haven't progressed? As I said, when one falls into the physical consciousness, everything seems to disappear. And after the physical consciousness, there is the subconscient. Are you aware of your subconscient? DR. MANILAL: No, Sir. But how to get out of this physical consciousness? SRI AUROBINDO: You have to get rid of ideas of the mind, desires of the vital and attachments of the physical. DR. MANILAL: But it seems to take such a long time and I don't think it is possible to do it by our own effort. I believe in Grace. PURANI: Yes, without doing anything ourselves, we want the Grace to do everything. DR. MANILAL: Why, I have been trying. SRI AUROBINDO: Are you sure? DR. MANILAL: Well, Sir, not in that sense. (Laughter) CHAMPAKLAL: What about you, Nirod? How did you feel at Darshan? NIRODBARAN: Don't touch the sore. CHAMPAKLAL: Let us hear. NIRODBARAN: I am in the same boat with Manilal. So I think I must be in the physical consciousness. SRI AUROBINDO: Very possibly both in the same doctoral consciousness. DR. MANILAL (after some time): You don't approve of that exercise. Sir — raising the thigh and letting the leg hang? SRI AUROBINDO: I stopped it during Darshan as I had things to do, and after Darshan I have been feeling lazy. I will try to do it again. PURANI (after Dr. Manilal had left and Sri Aurobindo started resting in bed): Champaklal wants to know if Manilal's condition of being in the physical consciousness began after his direct contact with you; that is, after your accident. SRI AUROBINDO: No, no. It was there long before. NIRODBARAN: It seems to be a great ordeal for those who begin with the physical consciousness, for it takes a very long time to get out of it. SRI AUROBINDO: Yes, sometimes it takes many years.
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NIRODBARAN: Unfortunately I have rarely had a single Darshan which could be called unusual and in this consciousness one is quite unconscious of what is happening. SRI AUROBINDO: Because it is a very thick crust -as I said, the thickness of the body. Usually it is because of this physical consciousness that people don't take to Yoga. Some people are predominantly mental, some vital and some physical. But it doesn't mean that those who are mental or vital won't have difficulties to face. They may have experiences on those planes but difficulties will come up later on. NIRODBARAN : Perhaps the yogic force works according to the characteristic feature of the individual. SRI AUROBINDO: Yes, of course. Stability is the nature of the physical consciousness. So, when anything is gained there, it is solid and stable. Experiences may be exhilarating but they don't always solve difficulties. H had many experiences on the mental plane but his vital revolted when it was touched. NIRODBARAN: When one is unconscious of what is happening one doesn't get the push. One swings back and forth, no steady progress can be maintained. SRI AUROBINDO: Very few people can maintain steady progress. Ups and downs are everywhere. NIRODBARAN: But they are more frequent here. SRI AUROBINDO: No, they are as frequent in other Yogas. What happens is that when the Force works the difficulties rise to face so that they may be dealt with, and one may not feel the progress though the work still goes on behind. NIRODBARAN : You said one has to get rid of desires and attachment in order to open the physical consciousness. If I am not deceived it seems my desires are not as strong as before and yet I don't feel the progress or rather I am not conscious of what is happening. SRI AUROBINDO: When I speak of the physical consciousness I mean the stuff of the consciousness, whether it is fine, coarse or thick. That stuff may get thinner and thinner and an opening may be made.
EVENING
DR. Manilal's departure day. Sri Aurobindo was massaging his knee. Dr. Manilal leaning against the bed. It was unusual for Sri Aurobindo to ask
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anything at this time, but as Dr. Manilal was to go he perhaps gave him a chance by asking, "Any more bumps?" Dr. Manilal replied, "No, Sir, no more of them." Taking the opportunity given, all gathered round the bed.
DR. MANILAL: By our contact with you, all our physical troubles should have gone. Sir. SRI AUROBINDO: Why? DR. MANILAL: The physical contact gives something directly to the physical, doesn't it? SRI AUROBINDO: Do you mean to say that if a person is touched by a Yogi, he should be all right for the rest of his life? DR. MANILAL: No, but if the yogi gives something, there should be an improvement in one's physical condition. SRI AUROBINDO: It depends on the person and the contact. DR. MANILAL: (moving his hand to connect Sri Aurobindo to himself): Here is the person and here is the contact. SRI AUROBINDO: In that case you don't seem to have benefited much by the contact. (Laughter)
NIRODBARAN: Satuda was lamenting the plight of Bengali Hindus. He says there is a cultural conquest taking place. SRI AUROBINDO: How? Hindus are becoming Muslims? NIRODBARAN: No, not religious conquest but cultural; Hindu culture being replaced by Muslim. At schools and colleges, books on Muslim culture are being forced on the students. SRI AUROBINDO: Why don't the Hindus react? PURANI : Instead of lamenting they should also organise something. SRI AUROBINDO: Quite so. NIRODBARAN: They have no leaders; that's the trouble. Satuda appeals to you to do something. SRI AUROBINDO: Bah! NIRODBARAN: Satuda had a small cut on his finger which made him so nervous that he postponed going back to Bengal by one day. PURANI : What will he do if war breaks out in India? SRI AUROBINDO: Perhaps he will go to Burma!
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EVENING
NIRODBARAN (when Sri Aurobindo laid down after walking): Dakshinapada had a vision: he saw you sitting high up radiating great power and light, as if by a slight movement of your body you could break the world and remake it. All the gods and goddesses stood around in adoration. Hitherto he has considered the Shakti greater than the Bhagavan. Now he thinks the reverse. SRI AUROBINDO: He is going to the other extreme now. NIRODBARAN: But he saw the Shaktis adoring you. SRI AUROBINDO: Yes, but they are Shaktis. NIRODBARAN: He feels some intense yearning within for something he can't reach due to some obstruction. SRI AUROBINDO: That is the psychic yearning, and the obstruction is the vital. He has to make the vital quiet to get rid of the obstruction. NIRODBARAN: Sisir Mitra asks if there is any difference in quality between a vegetarian diet and a meat and fish diet. SRI AUROBINDO: A meat and fish diet is good for fighters. But it makes the body-consciousness heavy — I mean the psychological stuff of that consciousness. NIRODBARAN: You have said before that the nature of food doesn't matter much in Yoga and that people here used to eat everything. SRI AUROBINDO: Yes, but all the same it has that effect.
NIRODBARAN: What is the significance of the experience in which the being is uplifted from the crust of the physical? SRI AUROBINDO: It is the liberation of consciousness by its rising upwards, free from the physical crust. Ordinarily it is this physical crust that prevents the consciousness from going within or upwards. What makes you ask? NIRODBARAN: Sahana had the experience, and she wants to know the significance. Just before Darshan she felt as if her whole being were uplifted from the physical crust which appeared like a hollow case. The experience lasted one or two days. Page- 265 SRI AUROBINDO: When any descent takes place, this crust prevents one from feeling it, but when the crust is removed the ascent can take place more easily and the higher force can also be brought down. It is the physical crust that gives the most opposition. There is, of course, the vital opposition too but the physical is stronger. Did Sahana have no such experience before? NIRODBARAN: I don't know. When such a liberation takes place, does it mean that the physical crust also becomes thinner? SATYENDRA: What did you say? Liberation makes the body thin? SRI AUROBINDO: Then the complete liberation will make the body ultimately disappear! NIRODBARAN: No, I said the "crust". SATYENDRA: Is it in continuation of your other day's question? SRI AUROBINDO: No, somebody had an experience of liberation. (To Nirodbaran) You passed her experience on and kept the crust perhaps for yourself? NIRODBARAN: Her experience came first. SRI AUROBINDO: Then she passed on to you the crust. NIRODBARAN: Does this experience mean anew stage in sadhana? SRI AUROBINDO: Yes. SATYENDRA: You said to somebody that the Adya Shakti, the Primal Goddess-Power of the Supermind, brings down the Supermind. SRI AUROBINDO: Yes. SATYENDRA: Brings from where? SRI AUROBINDO: From the higher planes. SATYENDRA: There is also the Unmanifest? SRI AUROBINDO: Yes, from the Unmanifest comes the Manifest. NIRODBARAN: Some people find your book The Mother very difficult. SRI AUROBINDO: I don't see what is the difficulty there. NIRODBARAN: No, it is not the style but the idea that they find difficult to grasp. The Chinese professor who is here read it and couldn't follow. After reading Anilbaran's book Songs from the Soul, many things became clear to him. SRI AUROBINDO : Then it must be the difficulty of the mind which is not prepared.
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A small ulceration had formed during the two preceding days on Sri Aurobindo's right shin.
SRI AUROBINDO (when his leg was being sponged): How is the ulcer? NIRODBARAN: Looks better. SRI AUROBINDO : It is the physical crust going the wrong way? (Laughter) NIRODBARAN: I thought it was the starting-point of eczema. SRI AUROBINDO: No, eczema starts with a vesicle. SATYENDRA: You had eczema there? SRI AUROBINDO: That was due to blankets and mosquito bites in jail.
EVENING
DR. BECHARLAL (after a long preparatory silence): How to see God in others ? You say it can't be done by the mind. SRI AUROBINDO: By increasing the consciousness and making psychic more active.
Just as this point the Mother came in and the talk was suspended.
PURANI: (while sponging Sri Aurobindo): There is a story, told originally by Lalji, of a Mahratta lady. In ecstatic moments of some descent from above, she can explain the Gita and other scriptures, though she herself is not educated. In those moments her face takes on a blue colour. She says the descent is that other of true Divine Self. But what is this blue colour? SRI AUROBINDO: The Divine Self means the Atman. Does she follow the Adwaita path? The Atman has no colour. Maybe the blue is of some being. She doesn't know herself? PURANI: No. Could it be Krishna's light? SRI AUROBINDO: Possibly-or Vishnu's. PURANI: Krishnamurti is giving some new principles now, but they are so amorphous. He says that to realise the Reality a Guru is not necessary. One has only to get rid of preconceived notions and ideas. SRI AUROBINDO: That is nothing new and can be easily understood. What further? Page-267
PURANI: Then one will find one's own Truth and Reality. But when someone asked, "What is this Reality?", he replied, "No one can say. One has to find it out for oneself." SRI AUROBINDO: Then what is the necessity of his saying the rest also? He may as well say nothing. Each one will find out his own path and Truth. SATYENDRA: Though he has relinquished Theosophy and Messiahhood, old disciples still seem to run after him. SRI AUROBINDO: Why doesn't he close his doors against them? He can stop speaking to them. SATYENDRA: He has started with a handicap—having been proclaimed a Messiah. SRI AUROBINDO: That is why he is disgusted with Guruship perhaps. The Reality he speaks of seems to be like Tao. When you realise it you can't speak about it. It is simply "nothing at all". NIRODBARAN (while Sri Aurobindo was waiting for the Mother to come): Nolini Sen is practically all right. Yesterday I told you that he was feeling a vague irritation and restlessness and a sense of sadness all day long, and badly needed assistance. He didn't know the cause of the irritation but yesterday he began to think of what wrongs he had done to others in the past. Then he felt as if somebody had touched him on the shoulder, after which he felt calm. He didn't know whose hand it was! SRI AUROBINDO (after laughing): He seems to be receptive. NIRODBARAN: He doesn't understand what is meant by the mental, vital, and physical consciousness. As for his wife, she says the intensity of pain and pleasure seems to have diminished in her. But at the same time she feels disinclined to do any work. SRI AUROBINDO: Does she feel like that after taking up Yoga? NIRODBARAN: Yes. SRI AUROBINDO: That often happens. When the motive that supplied the incentive to work or gave energy in the ordinary life is lost, such a condition sets in until that energy is replaced by another energy. CHAMPAKLAL : How to know whether or not it is Tamas? Page-268
SRI AUROBINDO: There is a certain element of Tamas in it. The physical is being driven by the rajasic vital energy and when that energy is not there the physical may fall into Tamas or inactivity. NIRODBARAN: What to do in such cases? SRI AUROBINDO: It depends on circumstances.. If one has no work to do, he can retire into silence. NIRODBARAN: But she can't do that with so many children to look after! (Laughter) SRI AUROBINDO: No, she can call in the higher energy and do whatever she has to do without being involved in the work or getting attached to it. NIRODBARAN: I told her that she could do everything as the Mother's work. SRI AUROBINDO: Yes.
At this point the Mother came. While sponging Sri Aurobindo, Purani took up the previous day's talk about the colour blue.
PURANI: I asked Lalji about the woman. She seems to be a devotee of Sri Krishna. SRI AUROBINDO: Then it is clear. NIRODBARAN: But why is only the face blue? SRI AUROBINDO: Because it is the mind that receives the light when she talks of the Gita and of other things in her ecstatic mood. SATYENDRA: You said yesterday that the blue colour might be of Vishnu or of Krishna. What is the difference between them? SRI AUROBINDO: Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva manifest certain powers of cosmic consciousness. Krishna manifests the Ananda. Krishna is said to be the Avatar of Vishnu, which means that he manifests the Vishnu aspect rather than the Shiva aspect. SATYENDRA: Are Vishnu and Krishna Gods of the overmind.? SRI AUROBINDO: Yes, that is, they manifest through the Overmind.
Purani then related a few more experiences of that Mahratta lady. There was no comment from Sri Aurobindo. After some time Sri Aurobindo himself started to speak. Page- 269 SRI AUROBINDO: About Nolini Sen. I don't understand what the difficulty is about the vital. What is it he doesn't understand? Just as there is the mind with its ideas and perceptions, so there is the vital with its forces of action, emotions, aesthesis. Is it so difficult? Perhaps he wants to know by experience? NIRODBARAN: Probably. He gave me one instance. He wants to know, when he hears music and gets joy, whether it is due to the song or the singer. SRI AUROBINDO: That has nothing to do with the vital. If there were no music but only the musician, would he feel that joy? Of course it is his vital—his aesthetic vital—that feels it and the musician also may be expressing his songs through his vital. PURANI: He told me about his difficulty with thoughts. SRI AUROBINDO: What sort of difficulty? PURANI: It is not a difficulty of intellectual ideas or perceptions; simply of the control of thoughts. SRI AUROBINDO: That is the life-mind. Of course his irritation and restlessness are due to the pressure of the psychic on his vital. His brooding or thinking about the wrongs he has done and the yearning within means that. NIRODBARAN: But the wrongs were done in the past. SRI AUROBINDO: That doesn't matter. It means that the psychic is putting pressure on the vital to change. (After some time ) Restlessness, irritation don't matter, but he must get some sleep. NIRODBARAN: He says he can't understand your English; he has to translate it into Bengali first to understand. SRI AUROBINDO: Why? Doesn't he know English well enough? NIRODBARAN: That's what he says. He was a science student, a classmate of Satyen Bose. SRI AUROBINDO: Which Satyen Bose? NIRODBARAN: Dilip's friend, the scientist. I think it is your terminology that he finds difficult to grasp-mental, vital, physical. SRI AUROBINDO: It is a demarcation which is not rigidly fixed. Each overflows into the others. In man, all are differentiated aspects or states of the mental consciousness in general. Page- 270
EVENING
The Mother came in with a telegram for Sri Aurobindo, smiled and said, "Another problem to be solved." The telegram said, "Praying permission for our residence."
THE MOTHER: Permission for residence where? Shall I ask back? SRI AUROBINDO: Don't know. Does residence mean the Ashram? (Laughing) It can be asked "Who are you?" (General laughter)
Then Purani read the radio news about Russia attacking Finland, and about the All India Sugar Conference being postponed.
SATYENDRA: Plenty of sugar has been destroyed because of a surplus. SRI AUROBINDO: Instead of destroying it, they could have given it free to the Ashram. (Laughter)
While sponging Sri Aurobindo, Purani brought up the war news.
PURANI: Molotov said Russia has no territorial claims. SRI AUROBINDO: Who? Vallabhbhai? (Laughter) PURANI: No, Molotov. SRI AUROBINDO: No territorial claims? Is it just a territorial walk then? Or is he going to deliver the Finnish people as he did the Ukrainians? I don't understand why these people don't clearly declare their objectives. PURANI: I hope the Americans will do something. SRI AUROBINDO: I don't think so. They can only talk. PURANI (when some of the others had gone and Sri Aurobindo was resting): There's a lady who used to feel your presence in her own home, just as at Darshan; but last time on her way home from here saw Ramana Maharshi and then lost that feeling. SRI AUROBINDO: Naturally. PURANI: At first she couldn't detect the reason why. Then she suspected the cause and I told her the Mother didn't approve of mixing up things. Now she thinks it must have been due to that visit. Page- 271
SRI AUROBINDO: That was another influence. Besides, if Maharshi had been alone, it would have been different. But there are always other people around. NIRODBARAN: But the purpose is the same - seeking for spirituality—and it is in the same line. SRI AUROBINDO: That is not the question. (After some time) Purani received something from Lele. PURANI : Oh yes, I know to my cost. He gave me a terrible fever just when I was in the peak of health; the fever left me only after I received a letter from here. My encounter with another Yogi gave me vomiting, giddiness, etc. Otherwise I got nothing from them. SRI AUROBINDO (smiling): But Lele did give you something after all. PURANI: Yes-but I didn't go to him again. Another friend after coming here asked me if he should go to see some Yogi. I told him he should not. He replied, "What's the harm? It is the same spirituality." I explained, "Maybe, but there are different spiritual energies and one may oppose another." SRI AUROBINDO: Quite so. PURANI: But the man didn't believe me. And he has paid the penalty for five years. He still hasn't come here again! Just as the sponging of Sri Aurobindo started, Nirodbaran prompted to Purani to begin the talk.
NIRODBARAN: What are these newspaper cuttings you have brought? PURANI: Cuttings from Paul Brunton. SRI AUROBINDO: What about? SATYENDRA: You have already seen these reports of his views on Yoga. SRI AUROBINDO: Oh! SATYENDRA (after a pause): He says he has plumbed the depths of Yoga. At the beginning he made some foolish exaggerations about the claims of Yoga. SRI AUROBINDO: They were not foolish but deliberate exaggerations with plenty of imagination. He wrote with an eye to the reading public. Page-272 SATYENDRA: He says he has given up his search for Yoga as he has plumbed its depths. SRI AUROBINDO: Yes, he wants to include Yoga in the educational curriculum. A queer affair, this European mind! SATYENDRA: He himself has gone in for several superficial things, magic, occult phenomena, etc. His book on Egypt has a lot of that stuff. He speaks of an Egyptian he met on the top of a hill, who prophesied the destruction of Europe. SRI AUROBINDO: That man 1200 years old, who had an Oxford accent in his speech? There was no Oxford accent 1200 years ago. It may be Paul Brunton's own Egyptian self and hence the accent. That book on Egypt is—(Sri Aurobindo began to shake his head). All the same, he had some sincere seeking for Yoga. It was spoiled by all sorts of people. He ought to have left everything in the hands of Maharshi. PURANI: He speaks highly of Vivekananda. He says he would have occupied the same place as Gandhi. SRI AUROBINDO: Which place? Wardha? (Laughter) PURANI: He means he would have had the same influence. SRI AUROBINDO: That's a different matter. He doesn't speak of Ramakrishna? PURANI: No, he speaks of Vivekananda. SRI AUROBINDO: What was at work was Ramakrishna's inspiration. SATYENDRA : The idea of starting Yoga courses is rather funny. SRI AUROBINDO: They have started a school on Rajayoga in America. But it has nothing of Rajayoga. NIRODBARAN: In Bombay also there are schools. SATYENDRA : They are for Hathayoga. SRI AUROBINDO: It was in connection with Hathayoga that I was at first puzzled. A Hathayogi was going about, lecturing that all moderns, including us, were of poor physique, with hollow cheeks. The next time I heard of him he was dead. (Laughter) He tried to be witty also: he used to say that our cheeks were like the Bay of Bengal. (Laughter) PURANI: B has started a weekly where he has written two chapters on your life. SRI AUROBINDO: That was a long-cherished idea of his and he wrote something in English. He also wrote about the Mother. He asked Andrews to review the book. Andrews said, "I can't review Page- 273
the book. I have known the lady." Then he wrote a book on the Ashram disparaging it and asked Arthur Moore to serialise it in The Statesman. Moore told him. he knew about the Ashram, for he had been here.
EVENING
NIRODBARAN (fomenting Sri Aurobindo's leg while he lay in the bed): Can feeling the Presence be considered being conscious of the Divine? SRI AUROBINDO: Yes, certainly. NIRODBARAN: Even feeling by the mind? SRI AUROBINDO: Yes, even by the mind. NIRODBARAN: One may feel at times the Presence without being conscious of the Divine? SRI AUROBINDO: Yes, the mind can feel just like the other parts of the being and feeling is the beginning of being conscious. (After a pause) Why do you ask? NIRODBARAN: Well, we were discussing what could be meant by "being conscious" and whether it was possible to express the experience in words. If a man thinks that there is a Presence around him, can it be called being conscious? SRI AUROBINDO: Oh, thinking! Thinking is of course different from feeling. But thinking may lead to feeling. SATYENDRA (to Nirodbaran): Why not thinking? One has to begin somewhere and, being human, one can start with the mind. NIRODBARAN: I don't object to that or question it. My question is whether that could be called being conscious. SRI AUROBINDO: As I said, thinking may lead to realisation. The Adwaitins begin with the mind and reach realisation through it There are many ways. There are people who can't meditate but by doing work with the right attitude they can establish the contact, and feeling this contact leads to realisation. NIRODBARAN: But being conscious of the Presence is a realisation? SRI AUROBINDO: Yes. NIRODBARAN: I thought it is an experience because it has not yet been established. SRI AUROBINDO: At least it is the beginning of realisation. Page-274
SATYENDRA (to Nirodbaran): Why not realisation? When one identifies oneself with the Divine and then comes back to the ordinary consciousness, wouldn't you call it realisation? SRI AUROBINDO: He means that a passing experience not yet completely established is not a realisation. SATYENDRA: In the old Yogas they have a term called Sahaj Samadhi, "easy Samadhi", by which they mean that the Samadhi has become part of one's natural life. SRI AUROBINDO: That is the same as the Gita's Samahita, "collected". There are also people who can by will bring down the state of Samadhi whenever they want it, while at other periods in the ordinary consciousness. That is an intermediate stage. There are others who may have experiences at the beginning and then none at all for six or seven years. NIRODBARAN: Yes, I belong to that group of unfortunate people. (Sri Aurobindo began to laugh.) SATYENDRA : Those experiences are a promise of future things, perhaps. SRI AUROBINDO: Yes. SATYENDRA (to Nirodbaran): Don't worry. If you feel you are lonely, I am with you. NIRODBARAN: That is hardly a consolation for me. (Sri Aurobindo laughed a lot.) SATYENDRA : No, but in ordinary life people forget their misery when they find others in the same state. They say, "There are others like me" and get some consolation. NIRODBARAN: That is when they are out of their misery. SRI AUROBINDO: No, in their miserable state itself they get relief. (After a little pause and smiling) Lucretius the Roman poet says somewhere, "It is sweet to sit on the shore and see people struggling in the sea." (Laughing) A Christian Father also says, "It is a great joy see people in Hell being tortured." DR. BECHARLAL (after some time): Somebody writes that while in jail your body lifted itself from the ground during meditation. Did anyone see that? SRI AUROBINDO: How do I know? I didn't see it myself. (Laughter) SATYENDRA: People ask this sort of question about you. Someone asked me too and I said, "He is not a magician. He is
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just as natural as we are." Another person asked if you were living in a cellar and food was being dropped to you SRI AUROBINDO: That is like Keshavananda. He used to live in a cellar. NIRODBARAN (after a pause): Due to which opening does one feel the Presence? SRI AUROBINDO: It depends on the way one feels. Purani brought a copy of The New Statesman and Nation in which there was a review by Joad of a book of Gerald Heard.
PURANI : Nolini says that this author seems to have got some of your ideas. SRI AUROBINDO: What does he say? I think he contributes to The Aryan Path also. PURANI: I have gone carefully through the article. What he says is that only in man is further evolution possible. SRI AUROBINDO: But one can arrive at that conclusion by thought. Nothing special is needed to reach it. And then? PURANI: This evolution is to take place by a change of consciousness. SRI AUROBINDO: What sort of change? Moral or spiritual? If it is moral, there is nothing new. Plenty of people have said that. However, you can send him a complimentary copy of The life Divine when the second volume is out. EVENING
NIRODBARAN (while sponging Sri Aurobindo): It seems Norway and Sweden won't join with Finland against Russia.
Sri Aurobindo began to shake his head, meaning that they would not.
NIRODBARAN: But they don't realise that their turn will come next. Is it to have a naval base that Russia has attacked Finland? SRI AUROBINDO: That is only a pretext. She wants to make Finland a vassal state like Latvia and from there dominate Norway Page-276
and Sweden. After she has done that and also gained her position in the Balkans, she will become a major power in Europe. She tried to get hold of Turkey but Turkey was too alert, and also bold enough because of the support of the English and French. The English have about a million soldiers in Asia Minor, so Turkey could be quite bold.. NIRODBARAN: Some say that Russia is occupying these Baltic countries as a check on Germany. SRI AUROBINDO: No, that's not the reason, though the Russians know that one day they will have to come to grips with Germany. Their object is to be a major power in Europe. NIRODBARAN (when Sri Aurobindo lay in bed): Professor Mitra has asked me to tell you that his native village is the same as yours: Konnagar. SRI AUROBINDO: I see, but I went there only once. My village is Theatre Road, Calcutta. NIRODBARAN: Mitra spoke of a professor at Shantiniketan who tried to dissuade him from coming here as he thought the Ashram stood for some particular creed. SRI AUROBINDO: What creed? Didn't Mitra ask him? And didn't he tell him that we have no creed? NIRODBARAN: Yes, he did, but the man wouldn't listen. Then this professor read Teachings of Sri Aurobindo. He was startled to discover that we have no creed, and he was very glad. (Sri Aurobindo began to laugh, much amused.) NIRODBARAN: Mitra says that Devendranath Tagore started Shantiniketan for a spiritual purpose, and he made rules, one of which was that idol-worship wouldn't be allowed there. SRI AUROBINDO: Then that is the place where there are creeds, not here. NIRODBARAN : Mitra has had two visions here. In one he saw a golden light coming down and condensing into the form of the Mother. SRI AUROBINDO: That is easy enough to understand. The golden light is the symbol of the Divine Truth, and the Mother is the incarnation of this Truth. NIRODBARAN: The other vision was of an intense blue light striking him in the eyes. SRI AUROBINDO: That is Krishna's light. Page--277
Purani brought a letter from one Padmakanti whose income tax had been assessed wrongly and who had appealed against the Government. The case was on the next day. SRI AUROBINDO: He ought to have written earlier. Not much time to save him. Where is the appeal? PURANI: In the revenue court, perhaps. SRI AUROBINDO: Are the officers just? PURANI: At present yes, because of the Congress Ministry. SRI AUROBINDO: There is no more Congress Ministry. The mind of a revenue collector is not an easy job to work on. A judge's, mind is different. NIRODBARAN (after Sri Aurobindo's walk): Did you say Theatre Road was your village? SRI AUROBINDO: Yes, I was born there in the house of the lawyer Manmohan Ghose. It was No. 4, I think. NIRODBARAN: Dilip says that that brought about his contact with you. (Laughter) PURANI: Have you read that criticism by Joad of Gerald Heard? SRI AUROBINDO: Yes. Joad doesn't seem to be much of a thinker. He says that he had the same ideas as the author but he changed them because of' the objections of philosophical critics. If he changes his ideas because of that, his ideas are not worth much. The first business of a philosopher is to anticipate the objections and then meet them. PURANI: He has written some good treatises on Plato and others. SRI AUROBINDO: That means he is a good teacher, not original thinker. PURANI: He has reviewed a book on Indian philosophy. SRI AUROBINDO: Yes, I have seen the review. He says he can't believe in Chakras because he has no experience of them! If one doesn't believe things one has no experience of, there will be few beliefs. Indian mystics have always said that only by Yoga can you have experiences, otherwise you have to take such matters on belief. Page-278 |